Kind of surprised about fans reaction.

Discussion and feedback for Playtonic's debut game, platformer adventure game Yooka-Laylee!
Yuke Quantum
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Kind of surprised about fans reaction.

Postby Yuke Quantum » Mon May 15, 2017 2:55 pm

I just think it's very odd that so many people are disappointed with the game. For a community to get what they wanted: a new Banjo-esque game with allusions to prior games and style, and at $40. I don't know if you guys remember the price of BK or BT, but it was full video game retail price.

I loved the game and will play it again. They're also promising free dlc... Sometimes I think people will never be satisfied no matter what. What people wanted, I guess, was another Banjo Kazooie game with those characters, but unfortunately PT doesn't own the rights to do that.

We, the fans, could be helping to sell YL to ensure we get a YL2 with all those things we want in it, but instead we're ballbusting?

I want to again repeat that YL came out at a discount price compared to other games. I didn't feel like I got a game that didn't live up to its promise. To me, it surpassed my expectations.

These guys basically started their own company and built a brand new game from scratch, all in a fairly short time, and I think we should give them a little leeway.

I hope I don't anger anyone. That's not my goal. You have your opinion and you're free to voice it. I just posted this in case it could enlighten some people who hadn't considered the hurdles PT had to face in creating brand new everything, including a business.
-Yuke Quantum
the thirst exploder

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Rueckkoppler
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Re: Kind of surprised about fans reaction.

Postby Rueckkoppler » Mon May 15, 2017 11:38 pm

Nah I still it's awesome that this company and this game exist. But even as someone who didn't play it, I think some critique points seem very legit and need to be discussed. This feedback only helps to improve the existing game and induce a probably even better sequel.

I agree though that some voices seem unnecessary harsh, like calling the game outright "trash". But screw these guys, right?

PandaLover
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Re: Kind of surprised about fans reaction.

Postby PandaLover » Mon May 15, 2017 11:57 pm

There are a number of design issues with the game, among other things. The thing most people dont talk about, is that the guy who designed this game is not from Rare's Nintendo golden age. He was one of the designers from Microsoft Rare, and all he really did was make mediocre/average games. That being the case its no surprise that YL for most people was just average, and I wouldnt expect things to get any better in the future. Past performance is the best indicator of future performance. A game being good or bad is mainly based on the designer, and Nintendo Rare had alot of great games and designers, unfortunately none of those people work for Playtonic.

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Rueckkoppler
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Re: Kind of surprised about fans reaction.

Postby Rueckkoppler » Tue May 16, 2017 8:32 am

"None" is outright wrong and you know that.

FailureFactory
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Re: Kind of surprised about fans reaction.

Postby FailureFactory » Tue May 16, 2017 12:01 pm

My issue isn't the size. My issue is how much they bloated things. The game has a number of characters that, in comparison, would support maybe 2 or 3 levels in BK, but not 5. The same goes for the visual variety in environments. So, I understand why they wouldn't want to do a micro-Banjo with the same variety and just two levels. But just making everything bigger and more repetitive isn't a solution, either. Probably they just should have asked for more money and more time in their kickstarter. I believe people would have accepted that, although it's an easy guess now, considering how the kickstarter went. On the other hand, they got a lot more money than they even aimed for originally. I don't want to know what the game would have looked like with just the bare minimum support...

Hopix
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Re: Kind of surprised about fans reaction.

Postby Hopix » Tue May 16, 2017 12:07 pm

Agree with OP. There are only a handful of valid criticisms in my opinion, perhaps lack of characters, the camera, and a couple of the challenges being boring, that's about it. People writing the game off as trash and failing to explain why are idiots. People criticizing the game because it has elements from BK and BT are spectacularly missing the point in its existence.

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dotEXE
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Re: Kind of surprised about fans reaction.

Postby dotEXE » Tue May 16, 2017 3:47 pm

I haven't seen any of this ballbusting from fans. I've seen maaaaaaaaaaaybe a few people complain about the camera or that one move in particular is overpowered. "Professional" Critics got their heads up their ends because the game is similar to Banjo, and to those critics the fans almost unanimously shouted "****ing duh".
Make the forum great again.

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Meinhard1
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Re: Kind of surprised about fans reaction.

Postby Meinhard1 » Tue May 16, 2017 9:04 pm

PandaLover wrote: The thing most people dont talk about, is that the guy who designed this game is not from Rare's Nintendo golden age. He was one of the designers from Microsoft Rare, and all he really did was make mediocre/average games.

1. Many key staff do work at Playtonic
2. YL design lead Gav Price worked at Rare prior to the buyout. Gregg Mayles (BK's design lead), has worked on and led numerous Rare projects with Microsoft, yet you don't come across as caring for them very much.

I'm not sure to what extent YL's apparent shortcomings reflect on the talent of design personnel. YL seems a successful low budget, 2 year KS project ... BK was in development for years and had to reinvent itself numerous times. Even in the later stages, some levels were entirely redone and Playtonic simply doesn't have the luxury to do that

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Rueckkoppler
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Re: Kind of surprised about fans reaction.

Postby Rueckkoppler » Tue May 16, 2017 9:40 pm

Meinhard1 wrote:I'm not sure to what extent YL's apparent shortcomings reflect on the talent of design personnel. YL seems a successful low budget, 2 year KS project ... BK was in development for years and had to reinvent itself numerous times. Even in the later stages, some levels were entirely redone and Playtonic simply doesn't have the luxury to do that


I hope they'll will, though.

PandaLover
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Re: Kind of surprised about fans reaction.

Postby PandaLover » Tue May 16, 2017 10:52 pm

Meinhard1 wrote:
PandaLover wrote: The thing most people dont talk about, is that the guy who designed this game is not from Rare's Nintendo golden age. He was one of the designers from Microsoft Rare, and all he really did was make mediocre/average games.

1. Many key staff do work at Playtonic
2. YL design lead Gav Price worked at Rare prior to the buyout. Gregg Mayles (BK's design lead), has worked on and led numerous Rare projects with Microsoft, yet you don't come across as caring for them very much.

I'm not sure to what extent YL's apparent shortcomings reflect on the talent of design personnel.


Programmers and Artists are not key talent, they are interchangeable and can be switched with anyone. In fact if you played the Xbone/Ps4 versions, those were programmed by people at Team 17, it makes no difference. So long as they are good enough to do what is required of them they make no significant impact on the game. Its not to say its an easy task, but there are plenty of people in the gaming industry who can do this.

Gregg Mayles does not work for Playtonic. Gavin Price was in Quality Assurance/Testing during Nintendo Rare, he was not a lead designer or anything.

Whether a game is successful or not is almost completely dependent on the talent of the design personnel, they are the ones who determine almost every aspect of a game. Its possible management could get in your way, but Gavin Price is also the head of the company, so that isnt an issue.

And Money and Time is not an excuse here either, many of the most succesful Indie games of all time were made with maybe 20-40 thousand dollars, not 2.5 million like YL and were also made fairly quickly. Of course if your an Indie studio you dont typically have any real time constraints as you are not owned by anyone and no one can tell you when to release a game. Indie games generally dont have much money, or pretty graphics, or fancy features, but they are able to succeed anyways with great game design.

GeneralWalnut
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Re: Kind of surprised about fans reaction.

Postby GeneralWalnut » Wed May 17, 2017 8:07 pm

PandaLover wrote:
Meinhard1 wrote:
PandaLover wrote: The thing most people dont talk about, is that the guy who designed this game is not from Rare's Nintendo golden age. He was one of the designers from Microsoft Rare, and all he really did was make mediocre/average games.

1. Many key staff do work at Playtonic
2. YL design lead Gav Price worked at Rare prior to the buyout. Gregg Mayles (BK's design lead), has worked on and led numerous Rare projects with Microsoft, yet you don't come across as caring for them very much.

I'm not sure to what extent YL's apparent shortcomings reflect on the talent of design personnel.


Programmers and Artists are not key talent, they are interchangeable and can be switched with anyone. In fact if you played the Xbone/Ps4 versions, those were programmed by people at Team 17, it makes no difference. So long as they are good enough to do what is required of them they make no significant impact on the game. Its not to say its an easy task, but there are plenty of people in the gaming industry who can do this.

Gregg Mayles does not work for Playtonic. Gavin Price was in Quality Assurance/Testing during Nintendo Rare, he was not a lead designer or anything.

Whether a game is successful or not is almost completely dependent on the talent of the design personnel, they are the ones who determine almost every aspect of a game. Its possible management could get in your way, but Gavin Price is also the head of the company, so that isnt an issue.

And Money and Time is not an excuse here either, many of the most succesful Indie games of all time were made with maybe 20-40 thousand dollars, not 2.5 million like YL and were also made fairly quickly. Of course if your an Indie studio you dont typically have any real time constraints as you are not owned by anyone and no one can tell you when to release a game. Indie games generally dont have much money, or pretty graphics, or fancy features, but they are able to succeed anyways with great game design.


You clearly have never worked in any creative industry and are 100% blowing smoke out your ass


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