Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

Discussion and feedback for Playtonic's debut game, platformer adventure game Yooka-Laylee!
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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

Postby Nanirourou » Fri Jul 29, 2016 6:43 pm

you kuh lady

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

Postby RustyRick » Fri Jul 29, 2016 7:05 pm

I sadly didn't get the chance to fund this game, so unless I somehow can get to play the toybox before the release, I'll have to go with what footage people cover it on YouTube. (Thanks for the link by the way, Taylor)

Game looks really gorgeous with it's graphical engine so far, and for a toybox area, the platforming and area's to mess around the controls and the mechanics look really well-made. The music's pretty catchy to listen to as well, and the dialogue from the tutorial robot was pretty much how I'd imagine the comical dialogue from a Rare-developed game to be.

This really convinces me to buy the game first-hand on launch day, hope you'll manage to iron out any possible bugs, Playtonic! ;)

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

Postby HaakonVII » Fri Jul 29, 2016 9:24 pm

I just wanted to mention that I hope the rolling animation will be more polished in the finished game. When you roll slowly it looks pretty stupid, and you can just stop while Laylee is just floating in the air, not having any of her feet on Yooka.

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

Postby Daiichi » Fri Jul 29, 2016 11:23 pm

Ok! So "Inept" send me here.

I am a sponsor who had the privilege to have the Toybox plus which gives you an attack...?
I have played in average of 3 hours with just fiddling around and bask in it's glory.
I am more or less knowledgeable about Banjo-Kazooie since I played waaay back in the days on weekends in rentals of the cartridges age. And recently now more than 30 hours playing of Donkey Kong 64.
I have played a lot of 3D adventure/scavenging games which are mostly on PS1 or N64 to not make an endless listing.

So I'll try to make a full review of: The Box of Toys.

First off the bat, you really polished it Playtonics!
Which was really nice since I could play with my PS3 controller on Mac with Fantastic Settings.

It felt tight with my controls in general. Most of jumps and coordination for combining high jumps needs polish but besides that in general it felt good with the camera and control response.

-Rolling and jumping is presented in a module and is for on point for precision. I do not know if pushing objects will be added but I had fun pushing and moving stuff. (Personal though it felt more or less like Mario 64. XD )
-Swimming was ok and I assume it still on the work.
-Long jump and High jump felt good with the environment.
-Got nothing really much to say about, jump stomping or attacking since it needs more interaction to know how it feels against more than one of enemy. It felt what it is to be doing right.
-For the angles you have set in a peculiar module in still position; I prefer the overhead angle better. Because I like the Pacman feels.

•3D environment:
Music and Modules tells pretty much where you are heading in the gameplay. With different sections that are puzzles, landscape parkour and visual explorings making me overjoyed by the precepts.
You even added some detailed stuff in visual pieces of decors; stone arcs, bridges, floating platforms, and even plants that had some hindrance physics. I appreciate these little touches. :D
Also hidden in places; partical effects, ground types, enemy animation...did I miss anything?

-Big slide module: needs to have a jumping capability. Maybe molehills? (Also Laylee needs to help stearing like flap her little wings to brake. A backward-belly [Yooka is sliding butt first] slide would be funny to add too.) Manoeuvers were not that hard to control, it felt ok.
-Gates & Switches module: Treasure Traps are very rare if I remember correctly. Liked it.
-Push-balls/blocks module: Pleasing ...I like pushing big crates/pink balls.
-Floor room: I liked the squeeky & fluffy floor.
-Rolling mountain Module/floating platforms/bridges space: challenging &/or good practice to know how they react to Yooka.
-Enemy Room spawn: like his animation, seen one with pants and a hat. Like that humour. :3
-Two exceptions my camera went weird because of collision: the last jump for the floating teeter ramps(?).
Your camera got pushed in between the ramps or besides the walls between the ramps if you didn't move the camera to a sideway angle. Also falling in between the start of the pillar ledge and the ramp.
The other one was that the camera went into a funnel overhead when you dropped in the tiny hole when you missed a crucial jump in the middle module with water and a DIY raft inside it.
On a sidenote, will there be cliffhanging, fast swimming, sidejumping or backflip jump ? That would be nice.

•Objectives & Goal difficulties:
In general, it ain't overwhelming of course. It was an interesting & a satisfying built. You didn't deviate into getting too easy or hard. A pretty good balance. Get thingies, get map, find button, find secret place. The more you search the rarer it gets and the harder it becomes. Old formula is good. Now to wait and see what to add to this.

•Final Note: You did good and most of E3 agrees, thing is, I ain't surprise by the results. I was just antsy just waiting the ToyBox.
P.S: That Xbone his father a Dalek?
P.P.S: Finding the Button treasure wasn't hard but...I was the type of guy who would play DK2 and rarely DK3 because of the difficulty challenges in searching stages.

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

Postby Unexpected » Fri Jul 29, 2016 11:41 pm

The controls and overall feel of the game are very nice, they're pretty much exactly what I was expecting from a spiritual successor to Banjo-Kazooie :D I loved the wind parts too, I can't wait to see what kind of challenges we'll see in the final game with that mechanic. Also, that robot is hilarious, I hope he shows up in the final game as well XD

Something I thought was weird was Laylee's animation when you stand still mid-roll. He doesn't stand realistic on top of Yooka like you'd expect, it's literally just the last frame of the rolling animation before you completely stopped. Minor complaint, I guess this will be fixed until the game's released, considering this is just a pre-alpha.

My main issue though is the camera. It never seems to go where you want it to. It always kind of snaps back to where it was before even if you move it. I had a really hard time climbing that tower that you had to roll to get to the top, because the camera wouldn't transition very well after each edge, and it was way too difficult to change the camera's angle while rolling at the same time. It felt like that session was way harder than it should be. Also, for those floating platforms, the top-down view was better. It was nice to see Yooka clearly.

By the way, it'd be nice to be able to hang from edges.

Overall, great job with the Toybox! It was very fun and I'm very excited for the final game :D
Last edited by Unexpected on Sat Jul 30, 2016 12:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

Postby thefro » Fri Jul 29, 2016 11:58 pm

Really impressed all around. I'm actually playing Banjo Kazooie for the first time on XB1 (never played it in the N64 days for some reason) and this captures the same feel really well.

Controls great, awesome music/SFX, nice graphical style.

The issues I had:
- Been pointed out by a lot of people, but an animation is needed when you're pushing up against something, whether a ball, box, or wall.
- Camera. Pretty serviceable while running around, but seems to snap to a fixed view too quickly. When you fall from a high spot it's also kind janky (granted you'll probably be dead in the full game). It also does some weird stuff when you're rolling.
- Roll move is weird with no idle animation and the fact that you can be stuck on a slope and not moving and not roll down. I also agree that it's hard to turn.
- The slick surface shouldn't make you instantly lose control unless it's really steep (over a 45 degree angle)
- I'd prefer a controllable camera or a side view for the seesaw section. Generally any time when I can't control the camera is annoying to me.
- I'd like to see the instrument samples change a bit for the themes when you're underwater, in addition to the muffled "underwater" sound.
- Textboxes shouldn't pop up and disrupt gameplay when you're in the middle of a jump. Check and make sure the player is on level ground and in a safe area first.
- Swimming. It took me a bit to get used to it but it worked well once I figured out I just had to move the analog stick once I got on the right level. I do think it's a bit more fun to have to pound a button to swim faster.
- It could probably be a little more intuitive as to the range for your glide jump. I got used to it by the end of the demo but there could be better cues as to when you're going to start falling.
- I was disappointed I couldn't climb up the palm tree trunks.

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

Postby Camerbro » Sat Jul 30, 2016 12:22 am

The squeaking noise when you are rolling is really irritating! It sounds like someone is scratching something near my ear, it's incredibly annoying. If the sound effect remains in the final game (which it most likely will) I can't see myself using it, unless I need it to get up a slope.

Control wise, my only complaints were I didn't feel I had much control when rolling around, as with the swimming. As well, the area with the tilting planks, the camera just went haywire in a few areas when jumping. All resulting in needing to climb back up to the top as I couldn't see where I was jumping with the camera trying to figure out which angle it wants to be at. Even if I tried to use the hover after the double jump for a slight safety net, it didn't work if I bumped into a plank.

I still expect great things from the final game though! I backed it for many reasons! Playing the toy box really showed off what to expect with its final release.

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

Postby ReturnRare » Sat Jul 30, 2016 1:06 am

I like how Inept was strategically placed so that you cannot see him in one spot while he is across from you in the other spot. I tried looking down at the ToyBox start area while I was with Inept inside the camera angles section, but the wall obscured my view of where Inept starts at. It gives it the illusion that Inept is really traveling around following you but I know that's not how it would be programmed. In the final games I bet Playtonic will have animations for characters popping out of the ground (Bottles) or warping to that spot in the case of characters that "move around" within levels such as Inept.

Also, I liked how in the bird's eye view room it felt like you were zipping around. Idk if it was an illusion or if you really sped up in that section. I think that both that and the isometric top-down view should be used in parts of the final game.

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

Postby Ojicon » Sat Jul 30, 2016 1:09 am

I made a list of feedback notes, I guess this is the right place for it.

Platonic Team, if you're reading this, I'm really loving this game, thanks so much for making it!! If I don't mention something below, it's because I really like it. I also tried not to mention things that were likely just lack of polish... anyway, here goes, hope this helps!

For perspective, I used Toybox + on Windows, collected 100 Quills, and found the secret at the end.

- Of the multiple camera options, Option 2 (top-down) was my preference. Both Option 1 and Option 3 make it difficult to tell what the puzzle even is, while Option 2's clear view lets me focus on solving it.
- PLEASE let us zoom out the camera. I often couldn't see the surrounding environment very well, and the camera kept getting stuck on small wall
- Because the movement axes are dependent on the camera, having the camera auto-focus behind the character can be frustrating. This is most noticeable when trying to Ball Roll around the corner of the tower.
- Yooka's fall speed accelerates a bit too quickly. While this works fine for long jumps, short jumps between platforms are difficult to time correctly and don't feel very graceful. There's no time for the shadow to appear, which is an important factor in aiming landings.
- Some extra friction would be nice, it currently feels a bit like I'm playing on an ice level. In particular, I'd like some more "stick" on the landing, as it's too easy to land on a platform successfully and then slide off the edge.
- There's not enough feedback when pushing the balls/boxes around, so the movement isn't very satisfying. (Am I supposed to be riding on top of the ball? That didn't feel right either.) Also, I'd love to be able to attack the ball to send it flying in a certain direction!
- Why is the Ball Run able to stand still on sloped surfaces? Mechanically I understand why you'd want that, but it doesn't make sense in terms of physics (which is why I didn't realize it worked that way at first)
- The "Combo Attack" doesn't seem to work at all. No matter how many times I pressed X, Yooka would always do the same spinning-tail attack.

Thank you again!! I really hope I could help, even a little!

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

Postby demonskunk » Sat Jul 30, 2016 1:16 am

I'm *loving* this so far. Mechanically, the game feels great, definitely looking forward to it.

That said, I noticed a few little weirdnesses.

First of all, is the animation for rolling. It looks great in motion, but when you stop, Laylee just... freezes in whatever frame she's at, and it looks really awkward. I'd say you should add a still animation with her just standing on top of a curled up Yooka. Maybe if you sit there long enough, Yooka unrolls slightly with Laylee still standing on his back, looking up at her and miming complaints?

Like other people said, the camera is wonky, and it tends to get caught on objects. Once it's caught, you can't shake it free either, you have to either keep going and hope it gets unstuck, or walk back to where it got caught. I'd prefer a more free camera - one that lets me look directly up or down, instead of limiting me like it currently does.

I find the security robot's 'voice' to be kind of grating and annoying, honestly, and I think there are a couple of times where the text boxes shouldn't pause gameplay - notably when you pick up your first quill, and when chests are explained to you. I think it'd be better if they allowed you to keep playing if you already know what you're doing. It's fine on a first play, but once you've gone through it once it gets a little irritating.

The swimming sound effect seems a little weird? It sounds like splashing, even when you're underwater. I'd personally think a muffled, watery "whoosh" would be better for your underwater strokes. I have to agree with a couple other people about the swimming mechanics, too. They don't feel very responsive. Maybe you could give the option to have them swim forward in the direction of the camera? I'm not entirely sure.

The first spin of the attack animation feels like it lacks speed. I'd love to see what it'd look like with a crash bandicoot-esque effect on it, some blur maybe?

Someone else mentioned it, but when you're rolling or spinning in the 'shallow water' ground type, I think there needs to be some kind of particle effect, or something, to reflect that. Water splashing around your feet as you spin, or water splashing behind you instead of dust when you're rolling. I also don't think the splash looks very convincing, it seems delayed after your step, but I have a feeling it'll look better in the actual game where water is not just a blue floor, yeah?

I like the inclusion of the shadow when jumping, but it looks awkward when you have a real shadow as well. I'd really like if you could hold one of the triggers or something while flying to get a camera that shows directly down, so you can line up drops more easily...

I think maybe the rolling could have slightly tighter control? going up the mountain is a serious challenge because you turn kind of wide.

And the animation for the wind looks a little weird? It looks great for the rolling animation, since you're rolling, yooka spinning faster makes sense. The walking animation looks wonky though. I don't know if there's a way to speed up one without speeding up the other, but... I'd like to see an animation of Yooka straining to walk against the wind, for when you're trying to walk against it.

That's about all I got, really. (I know it's a lot, but I really want this to be, like, the best thing ever, so I'm eager to lend all the suggestions I can.)

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

Postby Savage Rodent » Sat Jul 30, 2016 2:02 am

Just finished playing the Toybox+, and my worries have almost gone extinct. Controls felt really smooth and had no problems traversing the play area what soever. Jumping was controllable (if a bit OP), animations fluently went into one another, and the rolling move is a lot better than talon trot simply because you can switch in and out of it quickly, and I love it. I had zero issues with the visuals too. No frame drops, no texture pop-ins, nothing (though my computer is pretty beefy). I had some minor issues with the camera being sticky, but I found it to be not too bad and manageable.

My main complaint (well more of a disappointment) is the swimming, not because the ascending/descending has a rather long delay, but how swimming is in general. I see that they went with Conker's Bad Fur Day's swimming controls and tbh I personally don't really like that. Banjo Kazooie and Donkey Kong 64's swimming controls I thought were superior, and you had two different speeds you could swim at as well. I felt like I had a lot more control with BK's swimming controls than Conker's.
Yooka-Laylee should be its own game with its own feeling. It shouldn't try to be like Banjo-Kazooie, it shouldn't try to be like Donkey Kong, it should be like Yooka-Laylee.

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

Postby chameleojack » Sat Jul 30, 2016 2:12 am

Didn't previous Toybox press-releases say there was supposed to be a really cool secret WITHIN the demo that WAS NOT dependent on/requiring the game's release? So why then is the big reveal ?
Last edited by chameleojack on Sat Jul 30, 2016 2:16 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

Postby moritasan2040 » Sat Jul 30, 2016 2:13 am

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Re: Toybox feedback & discussion thread (SPOILERS)

Postby chameleojack » Sat Jul 30, 2016 2:32 am

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